Narrator> Making It Grow is brought to you in part by Certified South Carolina.

This cooperative effort among farmers, retailers and the South Carolina Department of Agriculture helps consumers identify foods and agricultural products that are grown, harvested or raised right here in the Palmetto State.

McLeod Farms in McBee, South Carolina, family owned and operated since 1916.

This family farm offers seasonal produce, including over 40 varieties of peaches.

Wesley Commons, a full service continuing care retirement community located on more than 150 wooded acres in Greenwood, South Carolina.

Additional funding provided by the South Carolina Farm Bureau Federation and Farm Bureau Insurance and Boone Hall Farms.

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ Amanda> Well, good evening and welcome to Making It Grow.

We're very happy to have you with us tonight.

We're coming to you from ETV Upstate and I'm Amanda McNulty a Clemson Horticulture Agent.

I'm here with my fellow Clemson person Terasa Lott.

We have said goodbye to Sumter while we came up here to see some old friends.

> That's right.

It's kind of like we've been taking a field trip.

Amanda> Yeah, yeah.

And we brought our desk so we feel like we're at home.

Terasa> Very comfortable.

Got our usual seats and some plants to make us feel like we're in the garden.

Amanda> Yeah, yeah, yeah.

We're glad to be here.

Cory Tanner, we have missed you.

And you're the Horticulture Program Team Director.

What all do you have to do to keep us, in the right direction?

> Well, I... it's been a little while, but I'm happy to be back.

No, I love my job.

I just, kind of set the direction for the team and let people go do their thing.

Amanda> How many people do we have, roughly?

Cory> Roughly, out serving the state and specific to horticulture is about 30.

That's agents and associates combined.

Amanda> Okay and we have people who work with homeowners.

<Right> And then we have, people who work with farmers, and we have all kind- Yeah.

Cory> That's right.

Amanda> Commercial and... Cory> Right.

Amanda> Yeah, home.

Cory> So we do a lot of consumer work, obviously for the home gardener, but then we also have agents out there that are specifically serving the fruit and, vegetable industry.

Amanda> Yeah, yeah.

Which is a big deal in South Carolina.

<It is.> Agriculture is big.

And, we're glad to help those people stay profitable.

<Absolutely> Yeah, yeah.

Nicole Goodman, you're an Urban Horticulture Agent in Spartanburg.

And I think you've got a Master Gardener class going.

> Yes.

I'm currently teaching another class of Master Gardeners, and it's a lot of fun working with these very eager, people that want to volunteer in the community.

Amanda> So do you have people who, are new to South Carolina and some who've lived here for a while?

Nicole> Yes.

This class has a lot of people from all over the country, especially California.

So, it's very interesting to see the differences on growing plants.

Amanda> California?

Gracious goodness.

So my kids went to California, and we got people who were in California and came here to South Carolina.

<That's right.> Okay.

Well, I'm glad you got a good class to work with.

That's delightful.

Okay.

Davis Sanders, always fun to have you come from South Pleasantburg Nursery in Greenville.

And you bring wonderful things to show us.

> It's always a pleasure to come, and I appreciate you allowing me to come in.

Amanda> And fall is a great time to plant, I believe.

Davis> Fall is the best time to plant anything hardy.

Amanda> Yeah, yeah.

And, y'all have a nice selection of things.

Davis> We do.

And, as each week passes, the selection gets better and better.

Where the hot weather is behind us.

So we feel a lot more comfortable bringing in a lot more specimens, stuff in the fall color items, pansies, violets, that sort of thing.

Amanda> Oh, okay.

Great.

Yeah, yeah.

So y'all get a lot of deliveries, I guess.

Davis> Yes, we do, in the peak of season we may deal with four or five or six trucks a day.

Amanda> A day?

Whoo, gosh.

Davis> Different vendors for different groups.

Amanda> Yeah, yeah.

I hope you have other people to help you unload.

Davis> We do.

We have a great crew that unloads the trucks for us.

And they're also very good with the customer service.

Amanda> Well how 'bout that?

Davis> Super team.

Amanda> Well, if I come, I'm going to have you help me.

Okay?

Davis> That's a deal.

Amanda> Okay.

We'll plan on it.

Okay.

We do have some fun things coming up too.

Amie Mabe is a 4-H'er and she came up with some very fun animals.

And then Durant Ashmore, who y'all probably remember, I mean, most of us do.

And he is now working on... American Revolution area battlefields here in the Upstate.

And it's just amazing how many things, happened here and how important South Carolina was in, you know, winning the Revolutionary War.

Proud of, proud of our ancestors.

If we had some here who were then.

Terasa, usually you've got some nice pictures for us to look at.

Terasa> "Gardens of the Week" is your time to show off both your skills in the garden and with taking photographs.

Let's take a look at this week's collection.

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ The last photo of a sunrise over goldenrod at Ashley Park in Summerville was just gorgeous.

And I want you to know that goldenrod is a very important late season pollinator plant for bees, butterflies, wasps.

And so I encourage you to consider adding some if you have space in your garden.

And as always, we appreciate all your photo submissions.

Don't be shy, when you see us make a call for "Gardens of the Week."

I hope you'll post your photos right there on our Facebook page.

And Terasa, I think we have a good many species of goldenrod here.

Some come in early, I mean... I've been seeing golden sides of the road for a long time now, and I do love to see it.

It's very beautiful.

And apparently that was, people made tea out of goldenrod when we, were fussing about the tea.

Terasa> Ah, that's right.

Stephanie shared about Liberty Tea, and how the colonists used alternatives to traditional tea.

Amanda> And, people fuss at goldenrod and think it makes them sneeze.

But tell people what it really is.

Terasa> It's more likely ragweed.

They just happen to kind of coincide with, with the bloom time.

And the goldenrod is more conspicuous.

So we make that association even though it's really not, not just.

So enjoy the goldenrod.

Amanda> Yeah.

And there's lots of stuff pollinating in South Carolina.

So, yeah, (Amanda sniffing) keep the Kleenex handy.

Don't you think?

<Yes> Okay.

Well... sometimes we can help some people or people have things that they want to show and tell with us.

Terasa> We are going to try to answer a question that came in from Matt in Liberty.

Matt found a critter and would like to know if we can identify it.

It was found next to the local REC football field.

Amanda> Really?

Cory, do you know what this is?

Cory> Yeah, so he sent in a picture and, what he has in his hand there is a mole cricket.

Yeah, it is in the cricket family, but it's not maybe as, pleasant as maybe Jiminy Cricket.

But, we have three species of cricket, of mole crickets in South Carolina.

Two are non-native one is native.

It's hard to tell from this picture which species this is, but given that it was in the Upstate, there's a good chance it's the Northern mole cricket, which is a native species and not quite as destructive to turf areas as the other two species are.

Amanda> Is that the main problem with people's lawns?

Cory> It's really, it is especially on highly manicured turf.

So golf courses can battle, battle mole crickets quite a bit.

They, we call them mole crickets because they tunnel under the ground just like a mole, except they're much smaller.

But they'll leave little mole ridges.

And you can imagine if that's on a golf course green.

That's not that's not conducive to good putting.

Amanda> And I guess, they dislodge some of the roots too could it hurt- Cory> Some species, depends on the species some are herbivorous and they eat grass roots and others are carnivorous.

And they eat other organisms in the soil.

But it's mostly the damage of actual tunneling where they push up those mounds that can cause problems.

But in a home lawn, it's really not a major concern.

There can be outbreaks in the coastal plain with sandier soils.

Where they can be a little bit of a nuisance.

But for most homeowners it's not going to be- Amanda> So generally, a homeowner doesn't need to get too excited about it.

But golf courses are pretty important to South Carolina's economy.

We have a lot of people who come here to play golf.

Cory> Right.

We have a lot of golf courses, a lot of people who come here to play golf.

We have professional golf tournaments in the state.

So obviously that's an important economic aspect of horticulture in the state.

Amanda> So do they proactively work on them sometimes or if they've had a constant problem?

Cory> Yeah, sure.

There are management techniques that can be used to, to cut down the populations particularly like I say on these non-native species that are quite a bit larger than the native species is.

Amanda> They make more of a mess too.

Cory> They can.

And some of them are attracted to lights at night, which can be a little bit- They do fly even though they're fairly large.

So it can be, if there's really high populations in an area, it can be a nuisance to have them come into porch lights and that sort of thing.

Amanda> Whoa, gosh.

Well, we know at the beach they tell people to cut the lights off for the turtles.

<That's right.> Maybe you should cut them off for the mole crickets too.

Yeah, yeah, we have a lot of urban light pollution... So, yeah, less... Yeah, okay.

Cory> That's right.

There is a fact sheet on HGIC if somebody is having trouble or trying to determine exactly which species and how to manage it, we've got information for them.

Amanda> They're not as attractive looking as a regular cricket.

<No> I'll tell you I had a cricket get loose in the house one time, it's hard to sleep.

(laughter) They don't go to bed.

Cory> They do not.

Terasa> But I like the sound.

So sometimes I'll just put on a recording of crickets.

to listen to.

Amanda> Okay.

To each his own.

(laughter) Oh, goodness.

You've got dogs I know, like I do.

And Blue now, when the ambulances come by- (Amanda howling) Do your dogs do that some?

Terasa> They don't.

But one of our foster dogs previously was a hound.

And if she heard a siren of any kind, she'd get out there and bay, yeah.

Amanda> It's kinda funny to hear isn't it?

(laughter) At any rate well, what's next?

Terasa> How did we get off track?

Amanda> I don't know.

Terasa> Well, earlier, Nicole and I were having a conversation about a plant that is beloved by some and others wish maybe it weren't so hardy.

But it's a host plant, and I think she brought a sample to show us and talk about its importance in providing... life cycle for a particular species of caterpillar.

Amanda> All righty.

Nicole> Alright, I'm going to start with the first clue.

A very fragrant and pretty flower.

Amanda> It's lovely.

Nicole> And I think you had it on- <Recently> Just a little while ago.

Amanda> Well and I didn't have a flower but I had the leaves and, and some of the fruits.

Nicole> Alright.

Well, I also brought a fruit.

<Good> And... How it looks, how it looks on the vine.

Here, if you do want to give this to Miss Amanda.

Amanda> Thank you.

Nicole> And what I was really excited about because I got them into my little terrarium a couple days ago.

And they're actually, currently two are starting to form into a chrysalis.

And then here I already have one.

Amanda> Wow!

And tell everybody what it is.

Nicole> So, it's the Gulf fritillary.

It's a native butterfly.

It migrates in, spring from Florida to South Carolina.

<Yes> This is where they're going to lay their eggs.

And then the caterpillars are going to hatch and start growing.

And what I was surprised about is it only takes about 7 to 12 days for them to stay in their chrysalis and then become a butterfly.

And then they migrate back to Florida.

Amanda> Is that considered pretty quick?

Nicole> Cory, that might be a question for you.

Cory> I mean, it's always amazing.

Some, some, butterflies and moths overwinter.

Amanda> Overwinter, yeah.

Cory> You know, chrysalis.

So I mean, yeah, but that's a pretty quick amount of time.

Amanda> So this one leaves here, it comes here they lay eggs and they turn into a butterfly here.

And then they fly back to Florida?

Boy, that's really a snowbird, isn't it?

Nicole> A lot of traveling.

<Yeah> And you can see maybe if I disturb it a little bit.

So they are still able to move.

Amanda> Fortunately, maypops have a big sturdy root system.

It's a perennial because sometimes the caterpillars will just eat it down to nothing.

Terasa> They're voracious eaters for sure.

Amanda> Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And, the fruits are edible.

I think you can eat it all and you can throw them at- You know, you've got two little boys, they can throw the fruit at each other and it won't hurt.

They're not hard, they're not hard.

And they get to be about the size of a ping pong ball, sometimes.

Cory> They kind of look like a non fuzzy kiwi.

<Yeah> Terasa> That's a good description.

Amanda> Yeah that's a good way to- Nicole> I like to let mine ripen until they're yellow and they drop naturally.

That's when they are the sweetest.

Amanda> So how do you, you just chomp down it.

Nicole> Yeah.

I just cut them in half and use a spoon.

And eat the pulp.

Amanda> Are they full of seeds?

Nicole> Yeah.

Amanda> I thought they were.

Nicole> Just like any passionflower fruit or passion fruit that you would buy at the store.

It's basically the same, just a different species.

Amanda> I've never bought a passionflower fruit at the store.

What store do you go to?

Must be some fancy store.

(laughter) We do not have those in St.

Matthews, South Carolina.

Nicole> It's not regularly.

It's not regularly that I find them.

And they're like, five dollars each.

Amanda> Ooh, well, we all need a treat every now and then.

<Yeah> Right?

Okay.

Terasa> Interestingly enough, even though this is a native species, I don't see it, at least in my part of the state commercially available, very often.

I will see other species, a red-flowered species.

But, I don't know if it's just some people consider it weedy.

I think it's beautiful.

And you were talking about it being so robust.

Funny enough, it doesn't overwinter at my house.

I have no idea why.

<Terasa> I have other vines.

Yellow Jessamine, coral honeysuckle.

I've planted it several times and every winter it dies and does not come back.

Amanda> Boy.

That's surprising.

Terasa> But if you plant it, they will come the Gulf fritillaries.

Cory> Yeah, I have one in a particular bed at home.

And I let them, I just let it come back every year.

I mean, I love the flowers.

Amanda> So yours comes back?

Cory> Yeah, it comes back.

Well, it's a lot colder where you live, than where you live Terasa.

Cory> Yeah, I don't think it's a hardiness issue.

There's some other factor probably involved.

But yeah, some years the fritillaries will eat it back to nothing.

And then other years, seems like I don't have any fritillaries come to it.

Amanda> Well there certainly are ebbs in the natural world.

<Cycles> Like this year, the fall webworms were just everywhere, you know, much more than we normally see.

Okay.

Well, thanks.

Yeah, yeah.

Gosh, if I see one at the store, I will... splurge and get one.

Cory> Well, there are a lot of tropical passionfruit or Passiflora, and people are familiar with that flavor are probably thinking of the tropical- <Okay> My family and I, we went to Costa Rica back in June.

And they would have several different types of passion fruit on, on the morning buffet.

<Come on.> Yeah, one of them was, they call banana passion fruit.

It's a long, slender yellow- Looks kind of like a banana, but tart, sweet-tart.

Amanda> Okay, but pretty enjoyable.

Cory> Flesh around the seeds.

Amanda> Okay, okay.

Cory> Very good.

Amanda> So you spit the seeds out or quietly, nicely... or swallow them?

Cory> Either way.

It's kind of like Muscadines.

Some of us swallow them and others spit them.

Amanda> Yeah.

I just, yeah.

Nicole> I prefer the taste of the native one over, I feel like they're much sweeter, especially if they fully ripen and become a little bit wrinkly, compared to what you can buy at the store.

Amanda> Okay.

You know, you might be able to order them.

Who the heck knows?

I ordered some of the Real Bananas one time.

You know, the ones that- Terasa> Yes, I have no bananas.

I think we had that conversation.

Amanda> It was fun.

Yeah, we had fun getting them in the mail.

It was kind of fun.

Yeah, it's fun to try something different.

I think I gave them to the kids for Christmas.

I was just thinking, what do you give kids that are grown up and have what they want, you know?

So we had the yes, I have no banana, bananas.

Anyway.

Okay.

Okay, Davis what you got for us?

Davis> Well, I have garlic.

Amanda> Okay.

Don't breathe on it.

Davis> Don't breathe on the garlic.

We... have, we're starting a tradition this year.

We're going to have the first Great Garlic Festival at South Pleasantburg Nursery.

We're going to try to educate people that you can grow garlic in South Carolina.

You can grow it successfully.

You can grow it year after year.

And so we, we have brought in, four different strains of garlic.

I've got three of them here.

And all of them, well, three of them are compatible with the climate all through the state.

The fourth one, needs a little bit cooler temperature, but I'll, explain the difference.

<Alright> The, one that prefers cooler temperatures is called a hardneck garlic.

This particular one is the Music variety.

Amanda> Music?

Davis> Music, uh-huh.

Right.

They tend to be a little bit spicy, quite piquant, in cooking, and very full flavor.

The ones that do best in our area are what are called the softneck garlics.

If you want, you can feel the difference between this one you can see, feel how that's the, that's the hardneck.

<Yeah> And this one is one of the softnecks.

This one is an Italian softneck garlic.

Amanda> Yeah, I can see- Davis> And then the third one is, the Inchelium softneck.

The softneck garlics do better here.

And... you can tell when it's time to harvest because the stem, the, foliage will gradually turn brown.

Amanda> So it's got, so it has, sends a stalk up.

Davis> It sends a stalk up.

Amanda> Talk to me about that.

Davis> And then as it, as the bulb matures- Amanda> Does it flower?

Davis> Usually you don't see the inflorescences here, but, in a cooler climate, you might see it.

But what will happen is the foliage will like a daffodil or a tulip the foliage will gradually turn brown when it falls over.

<Oh> It's time to harvest it.

<Okay> Dig it up and use it.

Plant garlic first of November- Amanda> So, do you pull these apart and plant the individual bulbs.

Davis> You can plant the whole bulb.

You can plant the individual bulbs.

It will take it longer to mature to a larger size if you, if you do break them apart.

But that's a great way to do it.

And, every time you harvest, you can always reserve a few to put back in the ground in November.

Usually these ripen, are ready for harvest in, in mid to late spring.

<Okay> So it's- Amanda> So if you put them back in the ground in November are you going to have one to harvest in the spring from that?

Oh, you will?

Davis> Yeah, you sure will.

And they do, they do multiply.

They do very well in the ground.

They also do very well in raised beds.

In the ground, they do need to be, you need plenty of organic matter, especially here with our red clay.

<Okay> And plant it with the top of the bulb about two inches below the soil surface.

So it doesn't have to go very deep.

Amanda> Not this part, not the stem part, but the actual top of the bulb.

Davis> About two inches.

Amanda> You can grow them in a pot, I guess couldn't you?

Davis> In fact, our garlic guru at the nursery grows his in a 15 gallon nursery pot.

We have another coworker- Amanda> Because it would be so easy to amend the soil.

Davis> Uh-huh.

We have another coworker who, who plants them in the ground every year, and she harvest beautiful garlic.

Amanda> Do y'all have something going on?

Are we going to eat garlic at South Pleasantburg Nursery?

Davis> I'm really not sure, it's going to be, it's going to be like our fall festival.

We, we'll have, we'll have different types of vendors there we might have a food truck or two.

<Okay> We haven't really, committed to a petting zoo, I don't think, but we've had a petting zoo there in the past.

But it's a big deal.

It's going to be on October 24th from 10 a.m.

to 3 p.m.

That's a Saturday.

<Yes> And, we'll be teaching people all they really never knew about garlic.

Amanda> Really?

Oh, that's the theme of the day.

Davis> It's, it's the Great Garlic Festival.

Amanda> Come on.

Davis> It's first one.

Hopefully it'll be the first of many.

Amanda> Well, I bet a lot of people who are vendors are going to come and maybe have some- Boy, you better have some chewing gum or something going on around it.

Davis> Yeah.

Never refuse a mint.

Amanda> Yeah, yeah, I would stock up on that.

Somebody, get a little Boy Scout or a Girl Scout troop in there and they can raise some money.

How 'bout that?

Davis> Sounds good.

Amanda> Okay, well, that's lots and lots of fun.

Thank you so very much.

Davis> You're welcome.

Amanda> Okay.

Well, we had so much fun recently because Amie Mabe came in.

She does 4-H and we had lots of fun with animals.

You're going to have fun watching this too.

Well, I'm talking today to Amie Mabe, and she is a 4-H Youth Development Agent in Greenville.

And we have some wonderful guests that she brought for us, too.

So tell me what 4-H is.

> Yeah, so 4-H is a youth development program that we have across the state, and it's the largest youth development program in the country.

<Wow!> Yeah, we get a lot of people that say, "oh, I used to be in 4-H as a kid," and don't realize that it's still alive and well right now.

Amanda> And so what age kids do you work with?

Amie> So we're open to ages 5 through 18.

And so we just opened up a new enrollment year.

So we are accepting kids right now.

Amanda> Fun.

And you have a lot of different things for them to do.

Amie> Yes.

So we have community clubs across the state.

And their membership allows them to join as many clubs and projects as they want.

So they don't have to just stick to their local area.

If they find something interesting across the way, they can join that too, so.

Yeah.

Amanda> Oh, y'all are easy.

<Yeah> Yeah, yeah.

And so, I think it's fun you're interested in these animals, and this is Shaquita.

And this is the first time she's had this leash halter thing on in her life.

She just came out of the cage.

Amie> Yeah, out of the coop, yep this morning.

We just threw a harness on her and told her she's going to be on TV.

Amanda> She's wonderfully, relaxed.

And I've never had such a relaxed, easy guest.

And, you said she's a Barred Rock.

And they are known for being good TV hosts, stars.

Amie> Yes, yep.

And we have a lot of 4-H'ers that have chickens.

It's a pretty easy project to get started with.

Whether you already have chickens, or we have what we call the Pullet Chain, where you can get, chicks from us.

So, if you have never started with chickens before, like, we help the families get started and they have record books and they can show them and they can even sell them too.

We help them all the way through.

Amanda> Wow and these lay eggs.

Amie> That's right.

Amanda> So what kind of egg- Does she lay a nice big egg or... Amie> Yeah.

Amanda> She's kind of a big gal.

Amie> So she helps with the grocery bill for sure.

Amanda> Okay.

Is it pretty easy to keep a chicken?

Amie> I would say so.

We live in city limits and we have them.

We're allowed to have hens.

Amanda> Oh, okay!

Amie> Yeah, yep.

Amanda> So she doesn't make a lot of noise in the morning like a rooster?

Amie> No, hens are pretty easy.

And, you know, most cities, they have a limitation on having roosters.

But hens, you can normally keep them pretty well.

Amanda> Okay, okay.

And then, who do we have over here?

Amie> This is Brownie.

She's a show girl.

Amanda> Gosh, she is so soft.

Amie> Yeah, so, Brownie is a Rex.

That's the breed of the rabbit.

They're kind of known for this very plush, like, super soft almost velvety fur that they have.

But we just started a rabbit 4-H club in Greenville County in Pelzer.

Where we're just teaching kids how to show rabbits, how to take care of them.

So, this fall, a lot of these kids are showing rabbits for the first time.

Amanda> Now the chickens, I guess, can stay outside, given cover and place to be, you know, out of the rain.

Can rabbits live outside or they usually live inside?

Amie> We keep ours outside.

In South Carolina, they're considered livestock so they can live outside, perfectly fine.

And I think, honestly, they're more comfortable out there.

There's no reason that, you know, that you can't have them inside.

Amanda> This rabbit's got a pretty good fur coat.

Amie> Yeah, yeah.

Amanda> Okay, okay.

And you said your kids who are... I mean, the baby doesn't show animals yet?

Amie> No, she helps me take care of them.

She definitely feeds and waters them with me, though.

Amanda> Okay, but you've got a four-year-old and a six-year-old and what's, what's the four-year-old getting ready to show?

Amie> He's about to show pigs.

Yeah.

Amanda> But not, and not a little teeny-tiny pig?

Amie> No, a full sized Berkshire pig at the fair.

So, you know, it's teaching him leadership.

Teaching him responsibility.

Amanda> Whoa.

And being in front of the public and being comfortable talking to people.

Amie> Absolutely.

Amanda> That's wonderful.

Amie> Yeah.

Amanda> Wow.

And gives it baths and feeds it... Amie> Marshmallows.

Amanda> Okay.

That's a treat?

<Yeah!> Is that how you get it to do what you want it to?

<Yeah> And then, what's your daughter going to have.

Amie> She's going to have another Rex.

Not this one, but we have another Rex rabbit that she's going to show.

And they do a lot of public speaking when they're showing rabbits too.

So they're actually telling the judge about the health and what they're looking at, about the breed standards.

Amanda> So, this is, I mean, this is training for life.

Amie> Absolutely.

We're teaching life skills.

You know, in 4-H we say "beyond ready."

That we're trying to teach them to be beyond ready as adults, as working citizens.

Amanda> I'm pretty proud of that.

Amie> Yeah, I am too.

Amanda> I'd be glad to have that kind of job.

I think you're doing a good job, and bringing out the future leaders of our state.

Amie> Yeah, well thank you.

Amanda> Well, thanks so much for coming.

And for bringing these wonderful guests.

Amie> Yeah, I think they did pretty good.

Amanda> I think they did too.

Those were well-behaved animals, and we were certainly happy to have them, weren't we Terasa.

Terasa> Yes, the first time I've seen a chicken on a leash.

Amanda> I know, and she said that's the first time that chicken had put that harness on.

I was amazed.

Yeah.

I've seen dogs not respond to a leash like that.

Yeah, you know.

At any rate.

Anyway.

So hats, hats, hats.

This grass is everywhere now in my part of the world.

And it's Sorghastrum nutans, I think.

And it's our state grass, I think.

Davis> Yes it is.

Indian grass is the common name.

Amanda> Yeah, yeah.

Anyway, it's, I think it's quite beautiful.

I see it get real big if the soil is good.

And then other places if the soils kind of, you know, marginal.

It's not so tall.

But I love to see it turn in the fall.

And I don't know if anybody offers it to the public or not.

Davis> It's generally available through mail order and, and seedlings.

Occasionally, a local nursery that doesn't depend on a lot of retail traffic will grow some of it out.

But, you can sometimes find it at native plant sales.

Amanda> Yeah.

So I don't know if, you know, it's usually kind of, it's not a big fine clump.

I don't know if you could plant it real close together and maybe have a more showy... Davis> You probably could treat it treat it almost like, broomstraw.

Amanda> Yeah, okay, anyway.

I think it's fun to see.

And then this little blue thing, slender silkgrass, I think.

When I see it riding down the roads, I say, "good gracious, there's a blue grass."

It's about this big.

And, I mean, and I just look and look, and look and look, and look and look.

And it really looks like this beautiful blue, gorgeous color blue- Not like any of y'all, not that y'all aren't gorgeous.

But, and then, and then all of a sudden it gets these little flowers on it and little daisy like flowers.

I just think it's one of the coolest little things I've ever seen.

I don't know much about it.

Terasa> Is that Pityopsis, is that narrowleaf silkgrass?

Is that right?

Cory> A grass that's not a grass.

Amanda> Is it Pityopsis?

Terasa> I think so.

<Okay> I can look it up to be sure.

Cory> It's in the sunflower family believe it or not.

Amanda> Well, Pityopsis is a wonderful name isn't it?

Great name, Pityopsis.

Yeah.

But anyway, it's just a cool little thing.

It's got this fuzzy little thing on the top.

I love, and it's growing where I see it the most is, kind of marginal soils.

And I'm sure somebody is really enjoying it.

Must be very important for some animals, I would think.

Don't you?

Davis> Yeah, it's beautiful.

Yeah.

Anyway.

Terasa> If it is indeed narrowleaf silkgrass, that is Pityopsis graminifolia.

I remember, T.J.

Savereno- Amanda> He talked about it.

Recently retired, but that was... I remember, him getting some in a part of a plant rescue one time.

Amanda> Okay, yeah.

So that, you read it as narrowleaf or slender but, you know, common names are common names.

But anyway, I love to see it and I think it's quite beautiful.

And, so I brought it up to put it in my hat.

Hey narrowleaf silkgrass.

Anyway, so Terasa.

I think we're now back to you.

Terasa> Yes.

We have another question from Jamie in Ware Shoals.

Said, "A lot of sweet potatoes I've recently dug have brown spots on their skin.

What causes this?

And are they safe to eat?"

Two really good questions.

Amanda> Yeah, I love sweet potatoes.

Gosh, I just think they're the best thing in the world.

And when I cook them, Terasa I, first I stick a knife in them... make some little dents in them, and put them in the microwave.

Two minutes on one side and one minute on the other, so I can cut them in half without having to get the sawzall out.

Because they're really kind of hard, you know?

And then I get a piece of aluminum foil and oil it and, put them face down and put it in the oven.

I've got one of those little ovens that sits on the counter.

And put it in there for like 45 minutes or so, at 400 or so, and they kind of caramelize on the bottom.

Gah!

It's just- And you can put extra ones in the refrigerator and have them the next night.

I think sweet potatoes are really good for you too.

Cory> Nothing beats a roasted sweet potato.

<Huh> Nothing beats a roasted sweet.

Amanda> Don't you think?

Gosh, they're good.

And remember how people used to store them in their yard?

Cory> I've heard about that and my grandparents would tell me about their sweet potato houses.

But I've never seen one myself.

Amanda> We had somebody who came on the show who used to do that and, of course Tony did it.

And I think you you just go out in the yard and you put some down and you put a lot of pinestraw over them, and then you put some more and you go out there when you need one and kind of pull it out.

Cory> I store mine in the crawlspace under the house.

Amanda> Okay.

Well, that's a good idea too.

Is it easy to get to them?

Cory> I mean, you go in there and get a dozen at a time and take them into the house or something like that.

Amanda> Okay.

Yeah, they are fun.

Yeah.

And of course, some people like to, you know, do them all up with marshmallows and all that kind of stuff, and that's fine if you want to do that.

But somebody had a question about brown spots on them, and I think you were supposed to answer it, so.

To get back to the issue at hand.

Cory> Yeah, so sweet potatoes I mean, one of the great things about them is they don't have a lot of pest and disease problems compared to some of our vegetables.

So, you know, it's a lot of bang for your buck with sweet potatoes.

But there are a couple of issues.

And the photos that Jamie sent in were of scurf, which is a, it sounds terrible but it's a fungal infection of the sweet potato skin.

So, if you're in the business of growing and selling sweet potatoes, it's bad news.

<Yeah> But if you're in the in the business of growing and eating sweet potatoes, don't worry about it at all.

<Okay> So it's purely a surface infection of the skin and it will leave these brown, that kind of will fade to black spots on the skin, of the sweet potato.

Most of us don't eat the skin anyway.

Although you can.

<I do.> I don't think there would be any problem with eating this, scurf.

Amanda> Well, if I fall over dead... Cory> But, yeah, for a home gardener, it's not really a big deal.

It can, there's not really any good treatments for it.

Probably- Amanda> It's not a big, I mean, since we're not doing it commercially.

Cory> Right.

If you're buying sweet potato slips or transplants, that's probably how it came into the garden.

And so, it's not super long-lived in the soil, like some diseases are.

So usually one to two years rotating away from sweet potatoes will, the disease will die off.

But, Yeah, not the end of the world if you are growing sweet potatoes at home.

Amanda> And, one time, I was at the State Fair when we used, you know, and answering questions and this man said "the first year, you know, I grew sweet potatoes and I got 1,000 pounds, and the next year I got 800 pounds and the next year I got 400 pounds."

And I was like- And I talked to Tony.

And he said that, sweet potatoes are naturally, GMO.

I mean, they just kind of naturally change their genetics.

And so every year you should start with fresh slips that you've gotten from somebody who knows what they're doing.

And that way you'll get a good crop every year.

So, even though a lot of people like to save things.

And growing sweet potatoes is fun, you know?

But, I believe that's correct.

Is that right?

Cory> Yeah, I mean, that makes sense.

There are a lot of certified sellers that, and sweet potatoes are one of those because you can get other diseases like viruses and that sort of stuff that could build up if you're, if you're growing your own over time.

So it's a good idea to at least periodically start over with fresh slips, especially if you want to be confident in the variety and the type of potato you're growing.

Amanda> Oh, alright.

Okay, good enough.

Well.

Terasa> What do we have next?

This question came in from Denise in Charleston.

And Denise would like to know if there are any alternatives for Lantana?

Amanda> Goodness.

Gah, Lantana can be kind of invasive in my book, but, what do you think?

Nicole> Yeah, it's starting to become more of a problem child, especially in the coastal area of the state.

If you're familiar with EDDMapS, where they track non-native species, you can see that there are several counties towards the coast where it's now showing up on roadsides and such.

And we don't like seeing that.

So there's always the question, "what can we use as an alternative?"

There are many different ones.

I came across an unusual native plant.

And I say unusual because normally when we talk about the butterfly bush, we also know that it's non-native.

<Yes> At least the one that we generally buy at nurseries.

But we do have native ones, not for South Carolina, but for the U.S., Texas and such.

They do have the Woolly butterfly bush that is native.

And the reason why I'm mentioning this, it's such a unique, beautiful shrub about the same size as Lantana.

It has bright orange flowers.

And the leaves are entirely silver.

And that's why it's Woolly butterfly bush.

Amanda> I wonder if it would be happy here if it likes Texas.

Nicole> So I did come across some seeds online.

And I'm going to try it out and see how it likes our state.

<Okay> And see what happens.

Amanda> Have you looked it up on the Lady Bird Johnson?

Nicole> Yes.

That's where I actually came across- Amanda> Okay, that's a fun site.

Don't you think?

<Yes> I love to look there.

Yeah, yeah.

Okay.

Well, Woolly buddleja.

Nicole> Butterfly bush.

Amanda> Butterfly bush.

Yeah, yeah.

Nicole> Buddleja marrubiifolia I believe.

Amanda> Okay.

Ever heard of it?

Davis> Haven't.

Not until today.

Amanda> Okay, well... You always say you learn something, but I always think you know so much.

But here you learned something today.

Davis> I always go home with more than I came with.

Amanda> Okay.

Alright.

Terasa.

Terasa> This question came in from Larry in Spartanburg.

Larry says, "I have an organic vegetable garden, but have a terrible problem with fire ants.

Is there any way to control them?"

Amanda> Aww.

Well, Davis, I think you've got a wonderful remedy for us.

Davis> I do, sort of.

This is a product called Come and Get It.

<Yes> It's the same delivery method as Amdro the more popular fire ant bait.

Only this one is a, Spinosad.

Amanda> Organic?

Davis> Organic insecticide.

It's a bacterial insecticide.

Harmless to people.

And it's, Spinosad is present in a lot of organic sprays and dusts.

<Oh, okay.> And this one is applied the same way as Amdro.

It's, it's a broadcast.

So this one is certified for, it is a certified organic product.

And we've found that, this is much more benefit for people who garden in raised beds.

Because a lot of times the, the worker ants, are the ones that really erupt up out of the, out of the soil in a raised bed.

And, this, this is a good control.

And since it- Amanda> But you scatter it and they take it back.

Davis> Exactly.

The only, drawback is from what we understand, the concentration of, of Spinosad on this is so strong that a lot of times, the worker ant will die before it gets it back into- Amanda> If it had to go a long way.

Davis> If it has to go back to get it to the queen.

You know, sometimes a fire ant mound can be 18, 20 feet deep.

<Yeah> And, so if the, if the carrier does if the, if the worker ant doesn't get it all the way to the queen, all you've done, is you've killed that worker ant.

Amanda> Yeah, yeah.

Well... it's worth a try.

Davis> It is.

And it's certified organic.

So if you've got, an organic garden, this may be one of the only things that you can use that will, that will help.

Amanda> And I think it said you don't have to put this one in the refrigerator, didn't you say that?

It used to be some of them, you know... Davis> They would be, <Corn meal> corn meal and the cooking oil or the vegetable oil, that they use to adhere the insecticide to the carrier would sometimes go rancid.

Amanda> And they don't like that.

Davis> Right.

But, that's how you can tell what, possibly what the carrier is.

If you look at a, a product like this, usually it will have an expiration date.

<Okay> And I haven't really done a lot of research on it, but Come and Get It does not have an expiration date on the, on the package.

So it may have a little bit longer shelf life.

Amanda> Alright.

Thanks a lot.

Well, where are we now?

Cory, what you got for us?

So, I just saw something the other day I thought was interesting.

Amanda> Oh, gracious goodness.

What fun.

Cory> And I thought people might be interested in seeing, these fruits.

Do they look familiar?

Terasa> It looks like a blackberry.

Cory> Looks like a blackberry.

Yeah.

So, but does the plant look like a blackberry?

Amanda> No.

Cory> Not at all.

Amanda> No prickles either.

Cory> If you saw the whole plant, you can kind of get an idea of what it looks like.

And what it might be similar to or related to.

But yeah, this is blackberry lily.

<Whoa!> These are the fruits of blackberry lily.

<Okay> A cool, it's non-native.

Amanda> Hold it still please, so we can really get a good shot of it.

Cory> Sorry about that.

It's in the Iris family.

<Yeah> And you can tell that by the flat leaves and how they're held on the plant.

But people might notice the blooms of these.

It's a fairly common garden plant.

I don't know that people notice the fruit very often, so.

Obviously, it's a well-named plant.

I believe it is now considered to be in the genus Iris.

Where it used to be Belamcanda.

But, little like, two-inch across orange blooms.

And I think there's a yellow cultivar as well that are kind of modeled, kind of a leopard, leopard modeling.

Amanda> Yeah, attractive.

Cory> In the late summer, July, August.

Amanda> Yeah, and they're numerous.

Cory> So every one of these fruits in the pods before they erupt, you know, they start out as these green pods and then eventually open to reveal the "blackberry."

Amanda> You know, I like to do arrangements and bring things in the house.

I think that would be really cool to have in the house in an arrangement, don't you?

<Yep> Wow, that is fun.

Cory> But don't eat them, they're considered toxic.

<Okay> So, not an edible blackberry.

Amanda> Okay.

Well, I'll stay away.

How about that?

Cory> Sounds good.

Amanda> Thank you so much.

Okay, Nicole, you got something for us too.

Nicole> Yes.

Amanda> Gracious.

Nicole> So, compared to the non-native species, I brought a native species.

This is the common name, is really beautiful it's called fire-on-the-mountain.

And I love that I have to use my cheat sheet here for the- Amanda> That's fine.

Nicole> Botanical name, Euphorbia cyathophora.

Yeah?

Davis> Cyathophora.

Nicole> Okay, good.

So, I maintain a rain garden up at Lake Lyman.

And, we have this popping up all over the rain garden.

And first I thought, well, this might be something invasive because we had also the, invasive honeysuckle and many other species.

Privet, Chinese Privet and such.

Yeah, we've done a lot of work.

My Master Gardeners have been an absolute blessing this, for this project.

But I started looking into what it could be.

I knew it would be some sort of Euphorbia because of the- Amanda> Milky... Nicole> Milky sap.

Yeah.

So if you are sensitive, don't do what I just did.

Wear gloves.

But, yeah, I started keeping it around, and I had it in my office, and all of a sudden I hear this little, almost like a drip sound.

And I was like, "oh, gosh, did I like overwater one of my self-watering pots?

Is it dripping all over my bookshelf into my library?"

Well, as I was, you know, running around the office, all of a sudden, something flings into my face.

So these seeds literally explode.

<Whoa!> And so I heard that popping sound that sounded like water dripping.

Amanda> Gosh, Pete.

And it's like a poinsettia but... Nicole> It is, but native.

Amanda> And it's a little bit weedy.

Nicole> Very weedy.

If it likes the area, very sunny, good drainage.

That particular rain garden is mostly sand and some organic matter.

It loves it up there.

We're pulling it up every single time we're up there.

We do leave clumps, but we want to have those very well maintained.

<Alright> So they look intentional.

Amanda> Okay, okay.

Does anybody enjoy it?

I mean, any butterflies or insects or anything that you know?

Nicole> I did not look that up.

But everything that is native has some sort of purpose.

Amanda> Okay.

Well, Durant Ashmore, who used to come and always bring fascinating plants, now has fascinating stories about Revolutionary War sites, battle sites in South Carolina.

I'm here with an old friend in a new role, Durant Ashmore.

Who used to come on our show because you had a nursery.

But gosh, Durant, you have gotten fascinated and really involved in the 250 Celebration, particularly, we had numerous battlefields here.

> Oh, we certainly did.

There's many a claim that South Carolina had more battlefields than any other state in the nation.

<Whoa> Now, New Jersey had a lot too.

We've got about, I suppose, equal number, depending on how you define a battlefield.

Amanda> Yeah.

And there was some great big battles and then smaller skirmishes.

Durant> Number of smaller skirmishes.

You know, three of the most important battles of the Revolutionary War in Kings Mountain, Cowpens and Ninety-Six.

But in addition to that, this was a hotbed of activity.

There were 100 battlefields in the backcountry of South Carolina.

<No> Within 50 miles of us, 100 Revolutionary War battlefields.

Amanda> Well, why was that?

Durant> Because, there was such an intense... fighting back here, this was a civil war.

The American Revolution in the backcountry of South Carolina was a civil war.

Amanda> Between the Patriots and the Loyalists?

Durant> That's right.

And then you have the Cherokee War as well.

16 Cherokee towns in Pickens and Oconee Counties were destroyed during the Revolutionary War.

(Amanda sighing) So that was part of it.

And then when Charleston fell and the British came through with their southern strategy, then, as they came through South Carolina, they thought they had South Carolina conquered.

95 percent of the state was conquered.

But the resistance from Thomas Sumter, Francis Marion when he entered the fray, and then, Andrew Pickens in the backcountry of South Carolina.

South Carolina has the triumvirate of the three most famous militia generals in the country.

Amanda> And who were they?

Durant> Well, they are, Marion, Pickens, and Sumter.

Amanda> Okay.

Goodness gracious.

Well, I've heard people say, course South Carolina likes to brag, that we, I mean, that really the tide, the war was won here.

Durant> Exactly.

You know, we say the war began in Boston and Saratoga was the turning point.

And Yorktown is where the war ended.

But the Revolutionary War was won in South Carolina.

Amanda> Well, you are now going to battlefields that people know of, and a lot of times you have to go in there and clear out invasive species and things.

<Yes> It's just awful, isn't it?

Durant> Well, as part of battlefield preservation and, that's a real fancy term, but, basically it boils down to pulling weeds.

Amanda> Well, cut... I mean, wisteria.

Durant> Yes.

Elaeagnus, English Ivy.

<Yeah> These are the banes of my existence.

And what I do, when we're looking at battlefield preservation, one of the first things we do is clear whatever underbrush and invasive plants are in there.

And allow a situation where an archeologist can come in and find- See we are on the cusp, the forefront of finding Revolutionary War battlefields.

This is South Carolina, leading the nation in this.

We are finding battlefields, about every six months or so.

Amanda> Durant!

And so archeologists come in and look for remnants of things that were there.

Durant> Right.

There's a field research team that goes through, these are expert metal detectorists.

And, this is all after extensive archival information and research is done.

These folks don't just go out there on a maybe.

They've, they found out in the historical record where, this battlefield most likely is.

Amanda> But, we didn't have maps like we do now.

We didn't have Google Maps.

Durant> There's confusion.

Oh, I know you.

It's difficult piecing together, where these battles occurred.

It really is?

And we're still searching for quite a number of them.

Amanda> Well, and fortunately, because of the work that you were in, landscaping and all that kind of stuff, you have equipment and know how to, safely eradicate some of these invasive species as well.

Durant> Exactly.

That's sort of one thing that I do bring to the table is the knowledge of what plants would have been there or how open the area was.

Or is it a wooded setting?

How do we recreate that?

Every battlefield site is different and have a different approach.

But, there's just a number of different techniques.

And the idea is to get these battlefields at a point where they can be interpreted.

Where you can see and you can visit and you can walk in the footsteps of these heroes.

Amanda> The people who saved our country.

<Yes> Who made our country.

Durant> Exactly.

Amanda> Yeah.

I think I grew up hearing so much about Cowpens, and I thought perhaps you'd talk to me and let our viewers listen, learn a little bit about that, because I think it was a stunningly important one.

Durant> It was very important.

And it's one of the most brilliant battles of the American Revolution.

Amanda> And the person in charge, not many people have heard of him.

Durant> Well, Daniel Morgan and I think a lot of folks have heard of him.

But his approach to the Battle of Cowpens was brilliant.

He adopted what is referred to as a defense in-depth strategy.

And he had skirmishers on his first line that were slowing down Banister Tarleton- Amanda> Who' a skirmisher?

Durant> A skirmisher is a sharpshooter.

<Oh, okay.> So he had sharpshooters out front.

And when Tarleton approached- Amanda> He was the head of the British troops.

<He was.> And apparently a real awful person.

Durant> He was an awful person.

But, the sharpshooters, the skirmishers, their orders were, aim for the epaulettes.

Shoot the officers.

And that's what they did.

And this came in very importantly towards the end of the battle.

But then, next his second line of defense was the South Carolina Militia.

And this is these local militia, the First and Second Spartan regiments, the Little River Regiment and Roebuck's Battalion of the Spartan Regiment.

Amanda> So these are people who were basically farmers and things, <Yes> who had some training and would get together when needed.

Durant> They absolutely were needed.

And they had experience because they'd been fighting for five years.

<Okay> But these were... really the best of the best, militia.

And when Tarleton and his men approached the militia line under the command of Andrew Pickens, the First Spartan Regiment let out a volley.

Amanda> A volley is?

Durant> A volley is where they all shot, fired in unison.

<Okay> And where that volley hit Tarleton's lines, there were lines of dead Redcoats on the field right there.

<Okay> Then the second- Amanda> And I want to interrupt for just a moment and talk about how exhausted his people were.

<Right> I mean, he may have been considered a wonderful general and all, but he brought his people- They were just on their last leg practically, I think.

Morgan knew this guy because he, saw the tactics from the Battle of Blackstock's, which was not too far from here.

And he knew that Tarleton charged headstrong into battle, and he used that against Tarleton.

And Tarleton chased, Morgan for 36 hours.

And as Morgan moved through the, territory, he was taking all the supplies that were anywhere around.

The farms were stripped bare.

They were foraged or plundered, depending on their, sentiments.

And now, as Tarleton comes behind him for the next 36 hours, no sleep, no food.

And that's why the battle started at dawn on January the 17th, 1781.

Amanda> Okay, so they had the first volley was shot.

Durant> Yes.

And then you have the militia line with the, Spartan, First Spartan Regiment firing the Second Spartanburg Regiment, the Little River Regiment, a Roebuck's Battalion of the Spartan Regiment.

Boom, boom, boom, boom.

And that was just decimating the... British line.

Amanda> And they'd already lost so many of their officers.

Durant> That's right.

And so now, under orders, the militia retreats around to the back where their horses were.

And Tarleton sees them retreating.

He thinks he has won the battle, so he charges straight ahead.

And now he comes into the third line.

Which the battlefield itself, the choice of that battlefield was brilliant.

Morgan had his continental officers and soldiers lined up in the hollow and Tarleton did not know that.

And all of a sudden he comes up and he sees those continentals, which are the best continentals in America.

Amanda> Were we, ours?

Durant> First and Second Maryland, and Kirkwood's Delawareans.

And great Virginia Continentals and Virginia Militia, North Carolina Militia.

This is the third line, this is the main battle line.

And as, Tarleton is approaching, he starts to make progress on the right flank.

And so Morgan gives the order to refuse the right flank, which means you just bend your line like that.

So now, if you're flanking, you've got a solid line that you are going against.

But that order is misunderstood.

And, they, the continental line starts to fall back.

And everybody is falling back now thinking that they're, having ordered to be retreated.

Daniel Morgan goes up to John Edgar Howard and says, he's the head of the Maryland Regiment, "Are you defeated, sir?"

"Do those men look like they're defeated to you?"

"Well, no they don't."

Amanda> He probably said more than, "no they don't."

(laughter) Durant> Well, okay.

Amanda> It is television.

Durant> He said, "Have them meet me on this hill."

So he retreated to a spot called, Morgan's Hill.

And the continental line came up, and as they were leaving, as they were retreating under order, they were loading their muskets.

And, when they got to Daniel Morgan, he said, "turn and fire."

At this time, the British had chased so far they were only 15 yards away.

And that was a devastating fire.

And the British line just collapsed at that time.

South Carolina Militia came in on one flank, William Washington and 3rd Continental Dragoons on the other flank it was a double envelopment.

600 prisoners surrendered.

<Whew!> And that was the best prisoner, 71st Regiment of Foot, the best regiment that the British had.

Amanda> And taken out of action?

Durant> Absolutely.

Amanda> Okay.

Durant, you, offer tours and meet people at some of these places <Yes> that have been identified.

I think it's fascinating.

And... I mean, a lot of these things are hard to find.

If people want to get in touch with you, we're going to put your email up.

And I believe they could call, get in touch and perhaps make arrangements to do that.

Durant> Oh, I'd love to, you know, taking folks to battlefields is one of my favorite things to do.

Amanda> I'm gonna come.

<Great!> It was wonderful to be with you again.

Durant> It was great to see you again, after all this time.

Amanda> Thank you so much.

Durant> Thank you, Amanda.

Amanda> Thanks, ETV Upstate for having us.

Thank you all for tuning in.

And we'll see you, next time.

Good night.

♪ ♪ ♪ Narrator> Making It Grow is brought to you in part by Certified South Carolina.

This cooperative effort among farmers, retailers and the South Carolina Department of Agriculture helps consumers identify foods and agricultural products that are grown, harvested or raised right here in the Palmetto State.

McLeod Farms in McBee, South Carolina, family owned and operated since 1916.

This family farm offers seasonal produce, including over 40 varieties of peaches.

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